3 Shifts Accomplished Women Can Make From Overlooked to Undeniable - Exclusive Interview With Yann Dang
Brainz Magazine Exclusive Interview
For years, women have been encouraged to build confidence, increase visibility and strengthen their leadership skills. But according to leadership coach Yann Dang, the next evolution of leadership requires something deeper: the ability to trust yourself, hold your authority and lead effectively when the pressure rises.
As the creator of COMMAND™, a leadership accelerator designed for accomplished women, Yann Dang explores why success alone does not always translate into influence, how internal patterns shape leadership presence and what it takes to move from being overlooked to undeniable.
Yann Dang, Leadership Coach
Are women being taught the wrong things about leadership?
I wouldn’t say the things women have been taught are wrong. I think they’re incomplete.
For decades, women have been encouraged to become more confident, communicate better, increase their visibility, build stronger networks, develop influence and strengthen their personal brands. Those things matter. But different levels of leadership require different skill sets and, I believe, different capacities.
Early in your career, success often comes from being exceptionally prepared, executing well, knowing the answers, following through and becoming someone others can rely on. As you rise, the nature of leadership changes. You’re increasingly asked to exercise discernment when there isn’t a clear answer, make decisions with incomplete information, challenge assumptions, navigate competing interests, hold boundaries, take calculated risks and move before you feel completely ready.
The skills that got you here still matter. But they may not be the skills that take you to the next level.
There’s also another layer we don’t talk about enough: cultural conditioning starts long before a woman enters the workplace. Many girls are taught early to follow the rules, be well-behaved, be likable, be helpful and get it right. Boys are often given more permission to be rough and tumble, take risks, make mistakes, challenge things and figure it out as they go.
Then we enter organizations and wonder why an incredibly accomplished woman, with significant authority and a track record of success, may still hesitate when there is no clear playbook or wait until she feels completely ready before she moves.
One of my former CFOs said something I’ve never forgotten: “I learn the rules so I can work around them.” He wasn’t talking about doing anything unethical. He meant understanding the system well enough to question it, be creative, push back, speak up and stir the pot when the situation required it.
That requires a different relationship with rules, risk and being right.
This is what became interesting to me in my own leadership journey and later in my work with accomplished women. These are women with the title, expertise, intelligence, experience and organizational authority. So rather than asking whether they need more confidence, I started asking different questions.
Can you still access your authority when a powerful person challenges you publicly? Can you communicate clearly when you’re asking for significantly more money? Can you hold a boundary when someone is disappointed with you? Can you trust yourself when there is no obvious right answer? Can you discern what you want to do and move before you feel ready?
That’s where I believe traditional leadership development can stop too early. We spend a great deal of time building the visible skills of leadership from the outside in. My work asks: what are those skills standing on?
Because you can build all the visible skills of leadership, but pressure reveals what they’re built on.
When the foundation isn’t strong enough for the level you’re now operating at, it can show up in incredibly subtle ways. You soften a statement you actually wanted to make. You overexplain a point you already made clearly. You reach for more data when what the room really needs is your discernment. You may even ask a question that sounds curious when, underneath it, you’re deflecting because you don’t want to fully own your position.
These moments are subtle, but you feel them. And often, the room does too. There is a difference between having authority and being grounded in your authority.
I know because I’ve experienced it myself, and I’ve witnessed versions of it in both women and men throughout my career. But women are navigating an additional layer of cultural conditioning around likability, ambition, authority, emotion and what it means to be a “good” woman.
That’s why I believe the next evolution of women’s leadership isn’t simply about adding more skills. It’s about strengthening the foundation beneath the ones we already have.
You say, “Your power isn’t missing. It’s fully allocated.” What does that mean?
I often hear accomplished women say, “I need to be more confident,” or “I need to find my voice.” But I also hear, “I’ll make that move when the kids go back to school,” “when this certification is finished,” “when work settles down,” or “when I have more bandwidth.”
These are not women sitting around doing nothing. Quite the opposite. They are often doing an extraordinary amount, both professionally and personally. They’re leading teams, delivering results, solving problems, caring for families and carrying significant responsibility. The question I’ve become interested in is whether everything they are carrying actually requires them.
A woman I spoke with recently captured this perfectly. She told me, “I know I should be spending my time building the relationship with our VP-level client, but instead I’m working on execution.” She wasn’t avoiding work. She was working incredibly hard and creating tremendous value. But much of that execution could be done by someone else. Building the senior relationship required her, and it also required something less comfortable: greater visibility, vulnerability and the possibility of rejection.
That distinction matters because sometimes what looks like a time-management problem is actually an emotional-capacity problem. We can stay extraordinarily busy creating value while postponing the work that requires us to become more visible.
I often tell my clients that part of the price of having a commanding presence is developing the emotional capacity for vulnerability, rejection and exposure, both positive and negative. The more visible you become, the more you open yourself to being evaluated, disagreed with, celebrated, criticized, promoted, rejected or misunderstood. You don’t get to choose only the comfortable forms of visibility.
Some of this also reflects the conditioning we discussed earlier, where women are often rewarded for getting it right and playing by the rules, while men are often given more permission to take risks, challenge them and recover from mistakes.
Systems and bias absolutely matter. They influence who gets heard, sponsored, promoted and given access to opportunity and power. But being overlooked isn’t always only a systems problem. Sometimes it’s also an allocation problem.
Professionally, your power may be allocated to execution, fixing, preparing or responsibilities someone else could carry. Personally, it may be allocated to taking care of things that could be shared. Internally, enormous amounts of power can be allocated to proving, pleasing, perfecting, overthinking, managing perception, anticipating reactions, avoiding conflict or managing other people’s emotions.
That’s why I’m careful when an accomplished woman tells me she needs to “find” her power. I don’t necessarily believe her power went anywhere. I want to understand where it is already being used.
For me, the more useful leadership question becomes, “Where is my power going?” Once you can see how your time, attention and emotional energy are being allocated, you can use discernment to decide whether that allocation is serving the leader you are becoming.
That's what I mean when I say your power isn't missing. It's fully allocated.
Can women internalize the very systems they are trying to overcome?
Absolutely, and I think we need to be able to talk about this without turning the conversation into blame. Patriarchy isn’t sustained only through policies, organizational structures or the behavior of men. Over time, some of its expectations become cultural norms, and cultural norms can become internal rules that influence how we see ourselves, how we behave and even how we evaluate other women.
Women often encounter contradictory expectations around leadership. We’re encouraged to be ambitious, but not so ambitious that we appear threatening. We’re told to speak up, while also being conscious of whether we are likable. We’re expected to be decisive, but risk being perceived as difficult when we challenge people too directly. We can be successful and powerful, while still feeling pressure to make that power comfortable for everyone around us.
When those messages are reinforced often enough, eventually no one has to explicitly tell a woman to make herself smaller. She can begin policing herself. She may soften what she really wants to say, question whether she is being “too much,” manage other people’s reactions before they have even occurred or decide an opportunity is too risky before anyone has told her she isn’t ready.
Women can also internalize these expectations in ways that affect how we perceive other women. We may judge another woman for being too ambitious, too emotional, too assertive, too visible or too self-promotional without realizing that we are evaluating her against a rule we have internalized ourselves. I think we have to be willing to examine that possibility without turning it into another reason to blame women.
One of the things I say often is that confusion naturally creates fear and can erode confidence. What we don’t understand, we tend to fear. If I don’t understand why I suddenly overexplain around one particular executive, why I become hesitant when I have to advocate for myself, or why I feel compelled to manage everyone else’s reaction when I set a boundary, it’s easy to interpret that response as evidence that I’m not confident enough or perhaps not ready for the level I’m trying to reach.
But when I can understand what is happening inside me, I have somewhere to go with it. That’s one reason women often tell me they feel a sense of relief when they learn this philosophy. We’re replacing self-judgment with self-awareness.
I don’t teach women scripts for how a powerful leader is supposed to behave, because I don’t believe there is one correct response to every leadership situation. I teach self-awareness, discernment, emotional capacity and self-trust. Those things can sound softer than strategy or tactics, but I believe they are some of the hardest leadership capacities to develop because they form the foundation of your inner authority.
Self-awareness allows you to recognize what is happening. Emotional capacity allows you to stay present with the discomfort instead of immediately trying to escape it. Self-trust allows you to remain connected to yourself when there is no obvious right answer. And discernment allows you to choose what the moment actually requires rather than automatically reacting from an old rule.
That is where I find this conversation empowering. Once you can see the rule you’ve internalized and understand what is happening inside you, you have a choice about whether you want to keep living by it.
We absolutely need to continue changing the systems around women. But part of becoming more powerful within those systems is understanding the ones that may still be operating within us.
You’ve developed the concept of Survival Masks. How does that relate to this?
Survival Masks are the language I developed for protective responses I repeatedly saw in accomplished women under pressure: the Ghost, the Good Girl, the Lone Wolf, the Fixer, the Ball-Buster and the Ice Queen.
They are not personality types, and they are certainly not evidence that something is wrong with a woman. In many cases, the behaviors associated with them were incredibly intelligent and may have contributed to her success. The Good Girl may have learned to prepare exceptionally well, anticipate what people need and become someone others trust. The Fixer may have become invaluable because she can walk into chaos and solve the problem. The Lone Wolf may have developed extraordinary independence and resourcefulness. These are real strengths.
What becomes interesting is what happens as your leadership expands. At a certain level, you have to become more discerning about whether a familiar response is actually what the moment requires or simply what has worked for you before. Do I need to solve this problem myself, or do I need to develop someone else to solve it? Do I actually need three more hours of preparation, or do I need to trust what I already know? Am I choosing not to speak because listening is strategically wise, or because visibility feels uncomfortable?
This is where COMMAND States come in. Once you have enough self-awareness to notice that you’ve moved into a Survival Mask, you create the opportunity to consciously shift into a different state of leadership. That might be The Visionary, The Grounded Leader, The Authority, The Connector, The Vision Holder or The Truther, depending on what the situation actually requires.
These aren’t scripts or personas to perform. They are intentional states of being that require consciousness, groundedness and discernment. The question becomes less about, “What should a powerful leader say here?” and more about, “Who do I need to be in this moment, and what does this moment actually require of me?”
That distinction is central to my philosophy because I don’t believe there is one correct response to every leadership situation. Sometimes the most commanding thing you can do is speak, and sometimes it is listen. It might mean holding a boundary, asking for help, saying “I don’t know,” or taking a calculated risk before you feel completely ready.
The goal isn’t to eliminate a Survival Mask. It is to recognize when one has been activated, create enough space to choose rather than react, and consciously shift into the COMMAND State the situation requires.
This is the philosophy behind COMMAND™. It begins with commanding yourself, not in the sense of controlling or suppressing yourself, but becoming grounded enough to remain connected to yourself when pressure rises. From that foundation, you can command the room by staying present, exercising discernment and using your authority intentionally with other people. Ultimately, you can command your career by making conscious choices about the opportunities you pursue, the risks you take, the boundaries you hold and the direction you want your leadership to go.
That progression, command yourself, command the room, command your career, matters to me because if you lose access to yourself when the stakes rise, it becomes very difficult to intentionally lead anything else.
What do you think women misunderstand about emotion and power?
I think women are often taught, directly and indirectly, that becoming more powerful means becoming less emotional. I disagree. I spent years working alongside senior male leaders, and they used emotion all the time. I saw anger, conviction, frustration, excitement, competitiveness and urgency expressed openly in leadership settings. The difference is that some emotions have traditionally been more culturally accepted in leaders than others.
I don’t believe emotion is the opposite of strong leadership. I see it as information. Anger may be signaling that a boundary has been crossed. Fear may be telling you that something matters or that you’re stepping into greater exposure. Discomfort may simply mean you’re entering territory you haven’t practiced yet. The challenge is learning how to understand what an emotion may be telling you without automatically allowing it to determine what you do next.
That requires emotional capacity. Can I experience disappointment without collapsing into self-doubt? Can I feel angry without immediately reacting from anger? Can I feel afraid and still take the calculated risk? Can I tolerate someone else’s disappointment without abandoning a boundary I believe is important? To me, that is a much more useful definition of emotional maturity in leadership than simply appearing composed.
I also think there is a cost when women repeatedly override what they are feeling in order to appear agreeable, polished or “professional.” Over time, that disconnection can contribute to the exhaustion, burnout and sense of being out of alignment with yourself that I hear from many accomplished women. You may look completely successful from the outside while internally feeling that maintaining that version of yourself is becoming increasingly expensive.
That is why I don’t teach women to become less emotional as they become more powerful. I want them to build the capacity to experience emotion, understand the information it may be giving them and then use discernment to choose their response. Emotion doesn’t have to make the decision, but suppressing it isn’t leadership either.
For me, the goal is not emotional control. It is being able to feel deeply without losing access to your authority.
How do you define executive presence?
Executive presence is the capacity to be in the here and now, emotionally and mentally, while moving toward an intentional purpose.
That sounds simple, but it isn’t. We live in an age where we are inundated with information, demands and interruptions at a level we have never experienced before, and AI is only accelerating that. Our attention is constantly being pulled somewhere else. For many women, there is another layer. You can be sitting in an important leadership meeting while part of your mind is still cycling through everything else you’re carrying. Did I send that document to the lawyer? What’s happening with that issue on my team? Did I respond to that email? What are we doing for dinner tonight? You may physically be in the room while mentally and emotionally moving between ten other places.
Then add pressure. Someone challenges your recommendation in a harsh tone. Are you still listening to what they are actually saying, or has part of your attention shifted to, “Why is he speaking to me like that? Does he not respect me? Does this person dislike me?” Before you know it, you’re no longer fully in the conversation. You’re in a conversation with yourself about the conversation.
That is why I think executive presence is much deeper than how confidently you speak or how polished you appear. Those things can influence perception, but they are the outward expression.
The foundation is your capacity to notice the mental and emotional noise without allowing it to pull you completely out of the moment. Can you come back to what is actually happening? Can you listen for the information underneath someone’s delivery? Can you notice your own reaction without immediately acting from it? Can you discern what the moment requires and respond intentionally rather than reflexively?
That, to me, is executive presence. It isn’t the absence of distraction, emotion or pressure. It is the capacity to return to the present despite them. And in a world increasingly competing for our attention, I believe that capacity is becoming more valuable, not less.
What does “undeniable” mean to you?
Being undeniable doesn’t mean everyone agrees with you, likes you or validates your decisions. It certainly doesn’t mean you stop experiencing fear, doubt or discomfort. In fact, the more consequential your leadership becomes, the more likely you are to encounter all three.
For me, becoming undeniable is much more internal. It is being grounded instead of braced, clear instead of overexplaining, present instead of proving. You know what you think without needing everyone else to agree. You know what you want without immediately making the desire smaller. You can receive difficult feedback without abandoning yourself, make a decision without knowing exactly how it will turn out, and have your own back afterward.
That doesn’t mean becoming rigid or believing you’re always right. Quite the opposite. When you aren’t spending so much energy protecting your identity, proving your value or managing how everyone perceives you, you have more capacity to listen, change your mind, admit what you don’t know and use discernment about what the moment actually requires.
That is what I mean by undeniable. Your power is no longer dependent on the room constantly reflecting it back to you. You can be powerful without needing to perform power. You’re not becoming a different version of yourself. You’re becoming a more fully expressed one.
What are the three shifts from overlooked to undeniable?
The first shift is from outside-in leadership to inside-out leadership. For years, much of leadership development has focused on what other people can see: confidence, communication, influence, visibility, personal brand and networking. Those skills matter, and many accomplished women already possess them. But I became increasingly interested in a different question: what are those visible skills standing on when pressure arrives?
You can be a confident communicator and still begin overexplaining when someone powerful challenges you. You can have a strong personal brand and still struggle with the vulnerability that comes with greater visibility. You can be highly influential and still find yourself people-pleasing or avoiding conflict when an important relationship feels at risk. The visible skill hasn’t disappeared. Pressure is simply revealing the foundation beneath it.
That is what I mean by leadership from the inside out. Self-trust, emotional capacity, boundaries, self-awareness, discernment, courage and inner authority create the foundation that allows those visible leadership skills to remain available to you when the stakes rise.
The second shift is developing a much deeper level of self-awareness. I often tell women that you have to go to school on yourself. Where do you go when you don’t feel safe? What happens when you feel challenged, exposed, rejected or uncertain? Do you overprepare? Become agreeable? Take over and fix everything? Withdraw? Get harder? Start managing everyone else’s reaction?
The patterns themselves tell you a lot, because once you begin studying them, you start recognizing them while they are happening rather than only understanding them afterward. That is half the job. If I can catch myself moving into a familiar protective response in the moment, I’ve created a small but incredibly important space between what I’m feeling and what I do next. That space gives me a choice.
This is why I don’t believe self-awareness is passive. It is a leadership practice. The more familiar you become with your own patterns under pressure, the more quickly you can recognize when an old protective strategy has taken over and use discernment to decide whether it is actually what the moment requires.
The third shift is from stepping into your power to developing the capacity to stay there. We tell women to “step into their power” all the time, but I think the more interesting question is what happens after you do. What happens when someone pushes back? When people don’t like your decision? When asking for more money makes you feel exposed? When a promotion changes an important relationship? When your ambition becomes visible in a way that makes someone else uncomfortable?
It is relatively easy to feel powerful when the environment is affirming you. The real practice begins when exercising that power creates discomfort, uncertainty or consequence. Can you remain connected to yourself without immediately retreating, overexplaining, apologizing or trying to make everyone else comfortable?
That is the evolution I’m most interested in. The next level of leadership doesn’t just require the courage to step into your power. It requires the capacity to stay there.
What is COMMAND™, and why did you create it?
COMMAND™ grew out of a realization I had after years in leadership and now coaching accomplished women: understanding something intellectually and being able to access it under pressure are two very different things.
You can recognize that you overexplain when you feel challenged, take over when you feel uncertain or become agreeable when there is tension. You may even understand exactly why you do it. But recognizing the pattern afterward is very different from catching it while it is happening, when the stakes are high and your instinct is telling you to protect yourself. That takes practice.
That is why I think of COMMAND™ as a leadership gym. It is a six-month leadership accelerator where women get weekly reps in the inner capacities that become increasingly important as their leadership expands. Every week we have a COMMAND Practice, something women can take directly into their real lives and leadership. One week it might be giving yourself permission to pause before responding. Another might be catching the story your mind is creating in a difficult interaction, making a bold request, taking up space without apologizing or overexplaining, leading a conversation from vision instead of getting pulled into the drama, or practicing how to return to yourself as a Grounded Leader when pressure rises.
The point isn’t to perform the practice perfectly. The point is to get the reps in. You build self-awareness by catching yourself sooner. You build self-trust by making decisions and learning that you can have your own back afterward. You build emotional capacity by staying present with discomfort rather than immediately trying to make it disappear. Over time, those repetitions begin to change what is available to you in the moments that matter.
There is also something incredibly powerful about doing this work alongside accomplished women from different industries and at different levels of leadership who ultimately want many of the same things: to be more in command of how they lead, to make a bigger impact and to be experienced in the room as powerfully as their accomplishments might already appear on paper.
What’s powerful is how quickly that normalizes the experience. A senior executive may hear a rising leader describe overthinking after a difficult conversation and recognize herself in it. A woman in finance may hear someone in technology, healthcare or another industry talk about hesitating before a bigger ask, struggling to hold a boundary or questioning herself after receiving pushback and realize, “I do that too.”
That matters because leadership can become increasingly isolating as you rise, particularly when you assume everyone else has somehow figured out the parts you’re still navigating. When accomplished women at different levels and in different industries begin recognizing themselves in one another’s experiences, some of the self-judgment can fall away. The challenge becomes something they can understand, practice and change.
COMMAND™ creates a place where women can be honest about what leadership actually feels like while simultaneously challenging one another to expand how they lead. The progression is intentional: command yourself, command the room, command your career. We strengthen the foundation beneath how a woman leads and then bring that work directly into the rooms, relationships and career decisions where it matters.
That is why the container exists. Insight can help you understand yourself, but repetition changes what becomes available to you under pressure. Insight alone doesn’t change how you lead. Practice does.
You talk about COMMAND™ as both a leadership accelerator and a movement. What’s the distinction?
COMMAND™ the container is where women practice the work. COMMAND™ the movement is how the work travels.
The accelerator gives accomplished women a place to build these capacities through repetition, but my ambition for COMMAND™ has always been larger than one program. I want these conversations happening in boardrooms, leadership teams, companies, women’s networks, communities and homes because the way women experience and exercise power affects far more than the individual woman.
For me, the movement represents a different standard for leadership, one where women don’t have to become harder, less emotional or more like someone else in order to hold greater power. It is also a standard that asks all of us to become more conscious of the assumptions we carry into a room. Self-awareness, emotional capacity, self-trust and discernment are sometimes described as “soft” skills, but I see them as essential leadership capacities.
This is where men have an important role to play as well. Some of the male leaders I have admired most throughout my career have been humble enough to recognize that bias exists, including in themselves, and thoughtful enough to reality-check their assumptions. A male leader who is bought into the COMMAND™ philosophy might pause and ask, “Would I be interpreting or responding to this behavior the same way if it were coming from a man?” He may ultimately reach exactly the same conclusion. The point is not to prescribe the answer. The practice is in the pause. Can I question the first story my mind created, reality-check my assumptions and then use discernment about what is actually happening?
Women need to do this too. We carry biases and assumptions about men, other women and ourselves. None of us is standing outside of the culture we are trying to understand. My aim with COMMAND™ isn’t to tell leaders which interpretation is correct. It is to help them become conscious enough to notice an assumption, reality-check it against what they actually know, and discern what the situation requires rather than automatically treating their first interpretation as fact.
That can be uncomfortable work because most of us would prefer to think of bias as something other people have. But the willingness to examine our own thinking is part of leadership. Who gets heard? Who receives the stretch opportunity? Who gets sponsored when they aren’t in the room? Whose ambition is encouraged? Who gets described as “difficult”? And are we applying those judgments consistently?
I saw a powerful example of this recently when a woman joined COMMAND™ because her male boss had seen one of my posts about How to Be Heard in a Room Full of Men and recommended the work to her. She leads a team of men, and rather than assuming he had all the answers for how to coach her through the dynamics she was navigating, he recognized that there was context he might not fully understand.
To me, that is allyship. He didn’t rescue her or speak for her. He had enough self-awareness to recognize the limits of his own perspective and used his position to connect her with a space where she could strengthen her own leadership.
That is the kind of movement I want COMMAND™ to become: women developing a different relationship with their own power, men becoming more conscious about how they use theirs, and organizations creating environments where people are willing to pause, reality-check their assumptions and lead with greater awareness and discernment.
You don’t have to be inside the COMMAND™ accelerator to participate in that movement. You can sponsor a woman, bring this philosophy into your organization, invite me into your leadership team or women’s network, open a door, share this conversation with someone who needs it or simply begin practicing a different standard of leadership yourself.
COMMAND™ the container is where women build the capacity. COMMAND™ the movement is how we bring that capacity into more rooms.
Ultimately, what do you want women to understand about their own power?
I want women to understand that their power may be much closer than they think.
I don’t want another generation of accomplished women spending their lives trying to fix themselves in order to become powerful enough. I want women to become curious about the power they already have and ask different questions. Where is my power going? What is it protecting? What rules am I still obeying? What am I carrying that someone else could carry? And what might become possible if some of that power were consciously redirected?
For one woman, that might mean finally making the bigger ask she has been postponing. For another, it might mean holding a boundary without spending the next three days questioning whether she was too difficult. It could mean delegating work that no longer requires her, becoming more visible, negotiating for more money, taking a calculated risk or pursuing a more consequential leadership role before she feels completely ready.
But the outcome I care about most is deeper than any promotion, title or salary. I want women to know what it feels like to remain connected to themselves when the stakes rise. To experience fear without assuming it means stop. To receive pushback without immediately questioning their authority. To disappoint someone without automatically abandoning a boundary. To become more powerful without believing they have to become someone else in order to hold that power.
That is what commanding yourself means to me. Not controlling yourself. Not suppressing emotion. Not always knowing the right answer. It is knowing yourself well enough, trusting yourself deeply enough and having enough emotional capacity to remain present and use discernment when the answer isn’t obvious.
That’s what I mean when I say your power isn’t missing. It’s fully allocated.
The question is whether you are ready to decide where it goes.
If this conversation resonates with you, share it with your leadership team, colleagues or network. These are the conversations I want COMMAND™ to bring into more rooms.
Join Yann for the free live masterclass, How to Be Heard in a Room Full of Men, on September 24 at 12 PM ET. Replay is available to everyone who registers.
The next COMMAND™ cohort begins October 7. COMMAND™ is a six-month leadership accelerator for accomplished women who want to get the weekly reps that strengthen how they lead when the stakes rise.
Want to be part of the larger COMMAND™ movement and help bring this philosophy into more rooms, organizations and communities? Sign up here.
You can also follow Yann on Instagram, LinkedIn, and visit her website for more leadership insights.
Listen to her podcast, The Balanced Leader, ranked in the top 2% globally, here.
