Written by: Zaiba Hasan & Uzma Jafri MD, Executive Contributor
Executive Contributors at Brainz Magazine are handpicked and invited to contribute because of their knowledge and valuable insight within their area of expertise.
Zaiba Hasan and Dr. Uzma Jafri are cohosts of the award-winning podcast, Mommying While Muslim. What started out as a quest to find answers to their own questions about raising American Muslim children in a post 9/11 America turned into an international support system for this community of mothers and their allies. Mommying While Muslim tackles a range of topics like their introduction says, “from potty-training to politics.” They invite us to sit at their virtual kitchen table for a glimpse of the world they face every day with their kids. Zaiba & Uzma have decided to put themselves in interview mode to change the format they’re usually operating in as podcast cohosts. Today, they’re in the hot seat!
Zaiba: Uzma, back in August of 2017 I “Facebooked” you with a strange request. Do you remember what that was?
Uzma: I do! You wanted my number because for several years we’d only been social media contacts and you wanted to talk, like real talking. With a voice and not a DM.
Zaiba: LOL.
Uzma: You had a harrowing experience flying while Muslim and called me to ask what resources existed in order to talk to your kids about what happened.
Zaiba: For anyone reading who doesn’t know what “flying while Muslim is,” can you explain?
Uzma: “Flying while Muslim” is a phenomenon known to Muslims mostly after 9/11 whereby anyone who “looks” Muslim, speaks Arabic or anything sounding like it, makes anyone from crew to passengers “uncomfortable,” can be pulled aside for non-random screenings by TSA or booted off a flight without any reasons given. As far as TSA goes, there are manuals that teach racial profiling and insist that that’s not what it is, but it is, and it sounded like that in your situation.
Zaiba: Yes, sadly, my 14-year old son who’d outgrown me in height back then was stopped by TSA for 3 hours for traveling without an ID. I had never traveled with identification for my kids until that point and you were so upset with me when you found out! Of course, it was many years post 9/11 and I took it for granted because as a mixed-race person, I am “white-passing” and had the privilege of attending my 4 young children until my son hit puberty. We recorded “Double Takes We Experience” to describe how people approach you and me differently based simply on how we physically appear in the world. It was eye-opening for me at the airport that day, and not in any good way.
Thereafter my son received what I now call “the Muslim man treatment.”
Uzma: How was that explaining it to him?
Zaiba: To be honest, it’s something that I continue to have to explain to my children. As far as traveling that day, I had to swallow the sad truth that my kids no longer look like me and I can’t project them anymore as an adult. They have to fend for themselves and know the right things to do and say, as well as the rights that they have as American and global citizens. Be kind, be polite, be brave and proud, but at the same time, be “smart.” These are tough “be’s” to reconcile. I don’t want them to rock the boat, but I also don’t want them to draw unnecessary attention to themselves. Does that make me a hypocrite?
Uzma: No, it makes you a responsible mom. I think to some extent, all socially conscious moms are doing what you’re doing, but as Muslim moms, our fear is that our kids get profiled and then don’t get a pass if they stand up for their rights. There have been so many cases when Muslim Americans, primarily young men, have been entrapped in the FBI’s program to crack down on domestic terrorists, but the most they’ve done is further alienate Muslim Americans who refuse to be their eyes and ears. We’re not on their payroll and owe them nothing, especially when we have Tariq Mhannas, the Newburgh Four, the Fort Dix Five, the Liberty City Seven. Even the names of these accused Muslims are so reflective of the false tactics used by the FBI to create an enemy in America because we ran out of them in the 80s. In any case, these are Muslim sons who have been imprisoned in many cases because they were led on by FBI undercover agents or simply had lies plastered about their activities. They’re already guilty before there’s been evidence, and then when the evidence is false, they have no chance. You’re not a hypocrite.
Zaiba: Since then I’ve signed up for TSA Precheck which allows us to go through security with the minor children without opening up all the luggage, taking off our shoes, etc because I was so scarred by that airport experience that I will never go through that again or have my children do so if I can avoid it. Also, check out “The Real Threat of Muslim Entrapment” we recorded about this specific FBI Counter Violence and Extremism program and its effects on our families. Besides Muslim entrapment in the United States, and I’ll guess across the globe, what other issues do we have to worry about in addition to the common things that keep all moms awake at night?
Uzma: Well, arguably in the developing world, there’s war keeping Muslim moms up at night. Besides literal bombs falling on their heads, there are economic sanctions, apartheid, or genocide forcing displacement. Fulfilling their children’s basic human rights of safety and health are threatened when they can’t access food, medicine, and shelter. The world sees this crisis of refugee resettlement but how about pulling the plug on refugee creation, right?
Zaiba: But THAT’S another podcast!
Uzma: I knew you’d say that! Back to our topics.
We worry about our kids’ educations in more affluent nations of the world, but in the US and many countries in Europe where Islamophobia may or may not be pervasive, Muslim kids suffer from discrimination based on their religion. Now, religious discrimination is not new and we can ask our Jewish brothers and sisters about that, but in the US in particular, Muslims got off easy for many decades before the War on Terror destroyed their false senses of safety. Since then, up to 60% of Muslim students reported being subject to hate speech or hate crimes in school as a result of simply being Muslim. For any nation that claims democratic ideals, this is an absolute travesty. THAT’S hypocrisy.
What other examples can you think of?
Zaiba: So far, flying while Muslim, religious dicrimination in schools, by teachers and administration by the way, not just by students. I think it’s important to point that out.
Uzma: Absolutely. 100%.
Zaiba: There’s job discrimination reported, especially when one has a “Muslim-sounding” name. And even if you look at our social circles, there are a lot of people who look at me and see a white woman with red hair and trash talk Muslims. It’s so alienating because I have to step up to say, “You know, you’re wrong. I know because I’m a Muslim.” And while it sets them straight at the moment, I don’t think it changes their mindsets and makes them want to stay or be friends with me to learn more.
Uzma: It’s harder to challenge our fixed, false beliefs. In medicine, we call those delusions.
Zaiba: LOL. On that note, we need to talk about our backgrounds to break some more stereotypes.
Uzma: You start. Tell people about all the waves you make on the daily.
Zaiba: Of course my first job is mom, and it’s my favorite title of all. Professionally, I have a background in finance and owned my own event planning company prior to starting the podcast. As my kids have gotten older, I’ve been able to go back to school and work on my real passion. Helping other mothers and developing an amazing team to do just that at EMERGE. There was no Ph.D. in parenting so I decided to create one myself! I have received training and/or certifications in the following (Parent Coaching, Sleep Training, Spiritual Mediation & Conflict Resolution, Positive Discipline, Adolescent Brain Cognition, topping it off with a Diversity & Inclusion lens focusing on motherhood in the workplace.
Uzma: And my full-time gig is also mommying, but I am a physician, refugee volunteer, and writer part-time. I own my practice serving geriatric populations right now because the flexibility in owning your own business exercises a ton of neurons and provides me ample time to unschool my kids. I also have 4 kids ranging from 6 to 13 and my oldest is a podcast fan, which is the biggest award I think Mommying While Muslim could receive.
Zaiba: He’s so cute, and he even recruits his friends to listen!
Uzma: Children are very particular about their listens and media time, so I think it speaks volumes about the utility of our show. Our podcast is recorded every Friday and we post the videos on Facebook and YouTube. The edited audio goes up on all podcast platforms the following Thursday.
Zaiba: We have a membership group on our Patreon, and you can get ad-free audio episodes that way, besides special features we record on Fireside. Our Facebook group is open to all moms and some of our most engaged are those non-Muslim allies we spoke about.
Uzma: This podcast takes up a lot of our time as we search for Muslim moms to represent, share their stories, and help people look at their false, fixed beliefs and maybe go, huh?
Zaiba: We are really appreciative of those that also tune in without fixed, false beliefs, and are here to be allies to us, and more importantly, to our children. Our hope is that if they see something hateful against Muslims happening, they will step up and say, “No. We won’t buy this lie anymore and we won’t let you use it.”
Uzma: Agreed, we love all our audiences and are so grateful. We’d be even more so if you’d subscribe to and share our podcast Mommying While Muslim, and leave reviews.
Zaiba: You really should follow us on @mommyingwhilemuslimpodcast on Instagram because watching Uzma engage with hateful messages is entertaining in itself, plus you find out about the social services we participate in at the podcast, and more about our guests.
Uzma: Last question: What’s for dinner?
Zaiba: I’m making vegetarian lasagna for my kids because I have 2 vegetarians, so salad and homemade vegan chocolate chip cookies. What’s on your menu?
Uzma: Frozen pizza, carrot sticks, and no apologies.
Zaiba: And that’s why we complement each other. I love you.
Uzma: I love you, too. Eat your veggies, everyone.
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Zaiba Hasan & Uzma Jafri MD, Executive Contributor Brainz Magazine
Zaiba Hasan is an American Muslim who grew up biracial and bicultural. Born and raised in Chicago, Zaiba’s Irish/Pakistani heritage and interfaith upbringing gave her a head start on navigating between identities. It’s therefore, no surprise that she is frequently invited to speak at interfaith events since her background makes her a natural at bridging gaps between Muslims and non-Muslims in the United States. A degree in Political Science and Communication further shaped Zaiba’s outlook on issues like race, immigration and nationalism, as well as her parenting philosophy, which is geared towards raising compassionate, responsible global citizens. When she isn’t busy with podcasting, public speaking, fostering interfaith community, or working on her Masters In Divinity & Spirituality, Interfaith Certification, & Parent Coaching Certification, Zaiba can usually be found on the basketball court or baseball field with her husband and their four children.
